Adventure Cycling Association Forum

Bicycle Travel => General Discussion => Topic started by: misterflask on October 30, 2021, 01:21:01 pm

 
Title: coffee coffee
Post by: misterflask on October 30, 2021, 01:21:01 pm
I used to travel with instant coffee which was a part of every morning and evening.  I recently took my Aeropress Go travel press on a car-camping trip, and oh gosh, I'm never going back to bad coffee.  But -12 ounces!- I won't be taking it backpacking and it gives one pause for bike touring. 

I once traveled with a cyclist who carried a Moka pot as his singular luxury, but that seems likely even heavier and cleanup looks a nuisance (the aeropress cleans up in moments with a dash from a water bottle). I have some light french presses, but just not a french press fan.  And again, cleanup.

It occurs to me that a Chemex style coffee maker might be a good compromise.  I don't make pourover at home because I'm far too important and busy (haha, no, but I do have a short attention span), but traveling I'm more in so-what-else-am-I-doing mode, or should be.

Recommendations, comments?
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: canalligators on October 30, 2021, 04:31:12 pm
If you are ok with instant, then you have a simple solution.

People make coffee too complicated and too expensive. All you need is hot water, coffee, and either a press or a Melita-type drip funnel.  With either of these machines, you can easily control strength and water temperature.  Use your coffee blend of choice, and with very little practice you get a good cuppa.

Recently I’m travelling with a group that makes coffee in a press (Adventure Cycling).  Not my fave, but ok. By myself, I prefer the Melita.  My biggest issue is that I really want real cream or half-and-half.  Can’t stand powdered creamer.  Fortunately, AC groups usually have real cream.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on October 30, 2021, 04:47:19 pm
French press coffee is good and there are setups that work with some of the titainium pots.  There are also a number of pour over setups ranging from under half an ounce to 4 ounces.  I think I'd buy a Primula or an MSR Mugmate if I wasn't okay with Via or some other premium instant.

Instant can be terrible but Starbucks Via is actually pretty good.  I have heard that Alpine Start is also good, but haven't tried it yet.  It is about a buck per packet.

By the way, for those who like whole milk in their coffee, on cereal, in oatmeal, or whatever Nido freeze dried whole milk is a good option.  It is often found in the ethnic food aisle.  It keeps forever in the unopened can and a pretty long once opened.  I vacuum seal small amounts individually for backpacking or touring so it keeps a bit longer.  At some point it gets clumpy and doesn't dissolve easily.  At that point I pitch it and get a fresh can.  I have never carried any long enough that it went bad during a trip.  At home I use half and half, but Nido is a decent substitute when it isn't available.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on October 30, 2021, 10:11:48 pm
Right. Life is too short for bad coffee.

At one point or another, I have brought along espresso makers, French presses, percolators, and what they now call "the pour over." There's also cowboy coffee, which simply requires a boiling pot of water.  Using a hand grinder/mill is always a good way to warm up for the day.

If you like filtered coffee then a 4-minute pour-over seems reasonable. No one said you had to lug a fancy carafe to have filtered ciffee. There are several  filters made to fit your camping mug, or alternatively, you can simply bag your freshly ground coffee in a filter paper sac and throw it in the pot.

 I should note that as much as I like coffee, on this summer's run of the GDMBR, I did not bring a stove.  If you want really good coffee, go a few days without and then stop at a small town coffee house. Nothing like a few days of abstinence to wake up those taste buds.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: jamawani on October 30, 2021, 11:50:02 pm
Coffee? Who needs coffee??  ;)
A nice bottle of night-chilled water is the ticket.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on October 31, 2021, 06:58:41 am
Coffee? Who needs coffee??  ;)
A nice bottle of night-chilled water is the ticket.
Well since you brought that up...  I often don't make coffee on tours.  I absolutely love my coffee and wondered if I was physically addicted so I tried a week in the back country without (before I was bike touring) and I was fine.  I realized I didn't need coffee to get going in the morning.  If I skipped it entirely I'd miss it but it wouldn't be the end of the world.  If I packed up and left camp without it.  It saved time and I could enjoy it at a stop 20 or 30 miles down the road at a diner.

So on road tours I often rely on diner coffee at second breakfast where first breakfast was a granola bar and water.

BTW, I guess I am the opposite of a coffee snob.  I prefer diner coffee.  I much prefer to get my coffee somewhere that no "lingo" is required.  If asking for a large coffee with cream and sugar leads to a session of multiple questions with inexplicable foreign words for the sizes and numerous other options, it defitinately puts me off.

It is better yet if I can just ask for coffee and they automatically bring cream and sugar to the table (or counter) and a smiling waitress comes by to refill my cup as needed.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: jamawani on October 31, 2021, 08:02:29 am
So on road tours I often rely on diner coffee at second breakfast where first breakfast was a granola bar and water.

BTW, I guess I am the opposite of a coffee snob.  I prefer diner coffee.  I much prefer to get my coffee somewhere that no "lingo" is required.  If asking for a large coffee with cream and sugar leads to a session of multiple questions with inexplicable foreign words for the sizes and numerous other options, it defitinately puts me off.

It is better yet if I can just ask for coffee and they automatically bring cream and sugar to the table (or counter) and a smiling waitress comes by to refill my cup as needed.

Aha! We are two peas in a pod.

I love to pack up early and be on my way.
The roads are mostly empty early on summer mornings -
and the sunlight is golden.

Then I come upon a little diner and have a great Second Breakfast.
With coffee. And the usual questions.
The cafe in Burlington, Wyo (pop. 250) is da best.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on October 31, 2021, 08:18:34 am
So on road tours I often rely on diner coffee at second breakfast where first breakfast was a granola bar and water.

BTW, I guess I am the opposite of a coffee snob.  I prefer diner coffee.  I much prefer to get my coffee somewhere that no "lingo" is required.  If asking for a large coffee with cream and sugar leads to a session of multiple questions with inexplicable foreign words for the sizes and numerous other options, it defitinately puts me off.

It is better yet if I can just ask for coffee and they automatically bring cream and sugar to the table (or counter) and a smiling waitress comes by to refill my cup as needed.

Aha! We are two peas in a pod.

I love to pack up early and be on my way.
The roads are mostly empty early on summer mornings -
and the sunlight is golden.

Then I come upon a little diner and have a great Second Breakfast.
With coffee. And the usual questions.
The cafe in Burlington, Wyo (pop. 250) is da best.
Yep rolling out of camp quickly at or before sunrise with no fuss is great.  Stopping at a little diner for breakfast with some miles under your belt is so satisfying.  The one big drawback?  Too often there isn't a suitably located diner and second breakfast winds up not coming at 20-30 miles and winds up much later and being lunch.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: LouMelini on October 31, 2021, 09:51:25 am
jamawani: thanks for the tip about Burlington. Unfortunately Julie and I went straight to Greybull (from Cody) on our September tour of the that part of Wyoming. I heard there is a great pizza place in Burlington as well.  I drink instant coffee, simple and quick; instant  makes me appreciate 2nd breakfast coffee in a cafe. I completely switched to instant on our Appalachian trail thru-hike when a campground host in Shenandoah made a big deal about coffee being a bear attractant.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on October 31, 2021, 10:27:34 am
jamawani: thanks for the tip about Burlington. Unfortunately Julie and I went straight to Greybull (from Cody) on our September tour of the that part of Wyoming. I heard there is a great pizza place in Burlington as well.  I drink instant coffee, simple and quick; instant  makes me appreciate 2nd breakfast coffee in a cafe. I completely switched to instant on our Appalachian trail thru-hike when a campground host in Shenandoah made a big deal about coffee being a bear attractant.
I like your basic stuff when it comes to regular coffee for brewing.  Maxwell House or Folgers is great for brewing, but when it comes to instant I get picky.  I tried a few that weren't fit to drink.  Not that I have tried many, but I was so put off by the few that I tried that I went to premium stuff or nothing when it came to instant.  Maybe I just didn't give regular instant a fair trial, but I tried a couple that were truly awful and gave up.  I think it was one of the Nescafe products that totally put me off of instant.

Do you have a brand you particularly like?  I might consider trying one again otherwise I'll either probably use the buck a packet stuff or nothing.  I probably won't resort to actually brewing coffee on tour.   It doesn't really fit my touring style.  On a canoe trip I am more likely to since I might pack heavier and am likely to stay with a group who invariable will be slow in leave camp.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on October 31, 2021, 10:45:35 am
I use the coffee bags from Folgers and Maxwell House as well - Maxwell House is better IMHO. Typical routine is heat water in pot; dip out some for cereal, drop 2 coffee bags in pot to steep. When done rinse pot, bowl, and cup and wipe with a few clean sheets of TP. - Ready to pack & go. All biodegradable - you should dig a Cat Hole for your grinds unless you are off the grid. I also make boiled coffee or cowboy coffee which is quite good.

Much rather have run of the mill diner coffee over Starbucks burnt flavor coffee - as long as it is fresh - no more than 15 minutes on the burner. I ask and have even had them offer to brew a fresh pot, but usually a good (busy) dinner is making a fresh pot every 10-15 minutes in the morning.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: LouMelini on October 31, 2021, 10:50:59 am
staehpj1: I don't have a favorite. I use Necafe Classico or Taster's Choice as it is generally stocked in my local grocery. I liked Maxwell house instant but it is hard to find locally vs. back east on the AT. From Target, I buy the individual servings of Hazelnut flavor to mix in. That helps but instant is always a compromise between taste vs. the convenience of instant coffee while packing up in the morning. It is hard to recommend any particular instant as one person's choice is another person's awful as you experienced.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: LouMelini on October 31, 2021, 10:58:20 am
hikebikecook: A cat hole is a good idea for the grounds. Maybe I will go back to my small MSR filter for pour through coffee. When bike touring I try to stay in campgrounds (parks, forest service or commercial) where I could easily dump grounds into a trash can. Thanks.

For Staehpj1 I should have said hazelnut flavored instant coffee in individual packets.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on October 31, 2021, 11:06:33 am
If I cannot get "good" coffee and need a caffeine fix I drink a cup of Earl Gray tea. Full of flavor and a good shot of caffeine.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: BikeliciousBabe on November 01, 2021, 09:39:53 am
Bodum Travel Press combination French press and mug. You drink straight from it, and it's insulated well.  I believe GSI makes something similar.

And La Colombe coffee, of course.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Westinghouse on November 02, 2021, 03:30:18 am
My bicycle tours were long and intense. For example, 54 days from southeast coastal Florida to San Diego, California, with only 44 days of actual cycling. The other ten were full rest days in motels. I got 35 miles on short days, and from 60 to 130 miles on good days, usually about 65. Mornings I was rootin tootin ready to go. There was little time for coffee. Coffee in restaurants, yes. Canned energy coffee in stores, yes. Starbucks only occasionally or hardly ever. There does not come to memory a tour where I carried and brewed coffee, myself. There is good hot coffee in McDonald's. What a variety of beverages there are that are called coffee. In one place they served ice coffee. They sweetened it. It was like pancake syrup sweet. It would spike blood sugar levels and jam the pancreas into discharge mode.

Some towns on the pacific coast bicycle route had coffee cafes. That is where you will find the richest, most delicious shot of caffeine. If you feed your addiction, do it right. East coastal Italy had fine coffee shops with the best cappuccino in the world. The coffee they brewed in Ukraine is a close second.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on November 02, 2021, 09:50:27 am
Coffee? Who needs coffee??  ;)
A nice bottle of night-chilled water is the ticket.
Physiologically it's true. A few minutes on the bike gets the adrenaline levels up and coffee has little if any additional effect. On tours ,I drink the coffee more for ritual and taste.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Galloper on November 02, 2021, 02:55:56 pm
I recently bought a Hario 01 dripper.   It's small, lightweight and makes very good coffee.   The weight penalty is slightly increased by paper filters but well worth it.   No need for a carafe, it sits on top of a mug.   Well worth a look.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: OHRider on November 19, 2021, 12:01:12 pm
My standard is two straws of Starbucks instant in a 12 oz mug every morning.  Seems to get me thru the day although if I stop at a restaurant I get coffee as well if it is in the morning.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: driftlessregion on November 21, 2021, 08:51:28 pm
The Bodun 15 oz travel press plastic mug weighs only 9 oz. Makes good coffee especially for the light weight.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Westinghouse on November 22, 2021, 03:54:12 am
The Bodun 15 oz travel press plastic mug weighs only 9 oz. Makes good coffee especially for the light weight.

It must be one hell of a device. I saw a man in a campground on the pacific coast route. He had a small espresso coffee brewer. He heated and drank at the table. Later I saw him in a coffee shop, and again in a food store, and again later on. He was cycling the coastal route. I love good rich delicious coffee. Though I would not carry a brewer, it is easy to understand why others would.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: BikeliciousBabe on November 22, 2021, 11:03:03 am
The Bodun 15 oz travel press plastic mug weighs only 9 oz. Makes good coffee especially for the light weight.
And keeps it hot for a good while. I don't leave home without mine.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Ty0604 on November 22, 2021, 02:39:42 pm
I started off using the French press attachment to my JetBoil but it’s a mess to clean up, harder when dispersed camping without a water supply. I usually eat oats for breakfast while on tour, which means having to make one or the other first and not both at the same time. I settled with instant coffee packets. It’s not the best but with enough creamer it’s fine. I usually got for convenience over taste etc.

Occasionally I’ll stop by a restaurant or gas station and grab another cup of cheap coffee if my camp coffee didn’t suffice.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: David W Pratt on November 25, 2021, 06:02:01 pm
If you want to carry cream with you, Mr. Canalagator, get the little, single serving plastic cups some restaurants use.  Yo have to carry the empties, but those weigh very little.  They keep without refrigeration.  I drink my coffee back, but I've used the coffee creamers to enrich couscous.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: canalligators on November 26, 2021, 06:16:13 pm
If you want to carry cream with you, Mr. Canalagator, get the little, single serving plastic cups some restaurants use.  Yo have to carry the empties, but those weigh very little.  They keep without refrigeration.  I drink my coffee back, but I've used the coffee creamers to enrich couscous.

Years ago I looked for them, and other single-serve items like mayo, with little success.  Few merchants carried these things, and those who did had them in far larger quantities than I cared to buy, e.g. boxes of a hundreds, or a thousand mayo packets.  On a quick look, it seems that situation hasn’t changed.  If I could buy twenty or thirty, I would go that route.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on November 27, 2021, 06:23:37 am
Asking a server for a few extra creamers or mayo each time you do order out is a good way to build up a few days supply. At a gas station or C-Store that sells coffee and uses those creamers a few $$ tip to the attendant would probably get you a small bag full.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 18, 2021, 11:58:48 pm
I looked at several travel coffee makers but after taking an AeroPress on a ride I found out it was too bulky, it took up too much space, not to mention the weight, which isn't horrible but any extra weight you can eliminate makes it a bit easier to ride.  So I decided to go with the GSI Outdoors Ultralight Java Drip pour over maker, this thing weighs next to nothing and takes up very little space, but more importantly, it makes a decent cup of coffee, it's not espresso, but it's better than drip makers or instant coffee.

I drink my coffee black so no need for carrying creamers or sugar.

I love the taste of coffee a lot, and the stronger the taste the better, but I don't drink a lot of it, I only have a half a cup with breakfast, and that's it for the entire day. 
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Westinghouse on December 19, 2021, 12:19:34 am
Somewhere they sell coffee in small bags the same way they sell teabags. That way all you have to do is heat the water and dip the bag in the water.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Iowagriz on December 19, 2021, 08:05:21 am
Check out Black Mountain Coffee. Approx 5 blocks east of Adventure Cycling HQ in Missoula.

On my last tour, several coffee addicted buddies bought their single packs and said they were much better then the Starbucks singles. Spendy little suckers, but good.

Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 19, 2021, 04:15:35 pm
I just pre grind my coffee beans the amount I need for the time I'll be gone and do it right before I go, put it in a ziplock bag, and pack it.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on December 19, 2021, 05:21:05 pm
I just pre grind my coffee beans the amount I need for the time I'll be gone and do it right before I go, put it in a ziplock bag, and pack it.
Or you can carry a lightweight plastic grinder that stores a few days of beans, as I used to. Modern versions cost between $25 and $150 dollars depending on how much of a coffee snob one wants to be.

It's all about water extraction of volatile flavors and caffeine. Reminder - although the caffeine is not volatile, and will not evaporate into the atmosphere after roasting, many of the flavors do. (The smell around freshly roasted beans are those volatile flavors escaping into the air.) Grinding increases how quickly those flavors disappear, so many of us grind right before use. A roasted bean at room temperature loses a lot of flavor and becomes stale after a week or two, depending on the nature of the roast.

Something to think about on long trips and when figuring out how one's going to compromise between freshly roasted and ground beans and the realities of camp.

Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 19, 2021, 11:19:32 pm
I just pre grind my coffee beans the amount I need for the time I'll be gone and do it right before I go, put it in a ziplock bag, and pack it.
Or you can carry a lightweight plastic grinder that stores a few days of beans, as I used to. Modern versions cost between $25 and $150 dollars depending on how much of a coffee snob one wants to be.

It's all about water extraction of volatile flavors and caffeine. Reminder - although the caffeine is not volatile, and will not evaporate into the atmosphere after roasting, many of the flavors do. (The smell around freshly roasted beans are those volatile flavors escaping into the air.) Grinding increases how quickly those flavors disappear, so many of us grind right before use. A roasted bean at room temperature loses a lot of flavor and becomes stale after a week or two, depending on the nature of the roast.

Something to think about on long trips and when figuring out how one's going to compromise between freshly roasted and ground beans and the realities of camp.

You don't seem to understand, I travel light, I'm not going to take everything including a microwave oven to go camping!  So no, I'm not going to carry a grinder.

While the coffee may go stale in a week or two, I can't carry a week or two of food on the bike, so when my baggy of coffee runs out I then have to get a bag or can of pre-ground coffee.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: BikeliciousBabe on December 20, 2021, 10:42:35 am

You don't seem to understand, I travel light, I'm not going to take everything including a microwave oven to go camping!  So no, I'm not going to carry a grinder.

While the coffee may go stale in a week or two, I can't carry a week or two of food on the bike, so when my baggy of coffee runs out I then have to get a bag or can of pre-ground coffee.

You'll be fine with a two-week supply.  When I go out for two weeks I bring pre-ground La Colombe coffee from home.  It holds up well enough during that time.  I am not expecting perfection.  You might even be able to re-supply with good quality coffee in larger towns/cities along the way.  The ex and I once started a 10-day trip from Missoula.  Flew out with out any coffee and picked up some upon arrival.  Had the place grind it for us.

I advise double bagging if using something like a plastic sandwich bag.  I didn't once and the bag got a small whole in a corner.  Had to shake coffee out of the pannier at the end of the tour. Not as easy as it might sound.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on December 20, 2021, 01:33:49 pm
I just pre grind my coffee beans the amount I need for the time I'll be gone and do it right before I go, put it in a ziplock bag, and pack it.
Or you can carry a lightweight plastic grinder that stores a few days of beans, as I used to. Modern versions cost between $25 and $150 dollars depending on how much of a coffee snob one wants to be.

It's all about water extraction of volatile flavors and caffeine. Reminder - although the caffeine is not volatile, and will not evaporate into the atmosphere after roasting, many of the flavors do. (The smell around freshly roasted beans are those volatile flavors escaping into the air.) Grinding increases how quickly those flavors disappear, so many of us grind right before use. A roasted bean at room temperature loses a lot of flavor and becomes stale after a week or two, depending on the nature of the roast.

Something to think about on long trips and when figuring out how one's going to compromise between freshly roasted and ground beans and the realities of camp.

You don't seem to understand, I travel light, I'm not going to take everything including a microwave oven to go camping! 

(...and you seem to forget - I'm the coffee snob that previously posted that to keep weight down, I have given up carrying a stove, gas, French press or espresso boiler, old hand grinder and coffee - at least on summer trips.)

My last post was simply to remind folks, that if they want really good coffee on the trail, it can be done - and I've done it, at the cost of about 3 pounds.

Life's too short for bad coffee, so if I need to keep the weight down, I get my coffee from the local coffee baristas.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on December 20, 2021, 01:37:40 pm

You don't seem to understand, I travel light, I'm not going to take everything including a microwave oven to go camping!  So no, I'm not going to carry a grinder.

While the coffee may go stale in a week or two, I can't carry a week or two of food on the bike, so when my baggy of coffee runs out I then have to get a bag or can of pre-ground coffee.

You'll be fine with a two-week supply.  When I go out for two weeks I bring pre-ground La Colombe coffee from home.  It holds up well enough during that time.  I am not expecting perfection.  You might even be able to re-supply with good quality coffee in larger towns/cities along the way.  The ex and I once started a 10-day trip from Missoula.  Flew out with out any coffee and picked up some upon arrival.  Had the place grind it for us.

I advise double bagging if using something like a plastic sandwich bag.  I didn't once and the bag got a small whole in a corner.  Had to shake coffee out of the pannier at the end of the tour. Not as easy as it might sound.
Well done.
Air-tight bagging should cut down on how quickly the volatile flavors leave the coffee during storage.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 20, 2021, 02:35:56 pm

You don't seem to understand, I travel light, I'm not going to take everything including a microwave oven to go camping!  So no, I'm not going to carry a grinder.

While the coffee may go stale in a week or two, I can't carry a week or two of food on the bike, so when my baggy of coffee runs out I then have to get a bag or can of pre-ground coffee.

You'll be fine with a two-week supply.  When I go out for two weeks I bring pre-ground La Colombe coffee from home.  It holds up well enough during that time.  I am not expecting perfection.  You might even be able to re-supply with good quality coffee in larger towns/cities along the way.  The ex and I once started a 10-day trip from Missoula.  Flew out with out any coffee and picked up some upon arrival.  Had the place grind it for us.

I advise double bagging if using something like a plastic sandwich bag.  I didn't once and the bag got a small whole in a corner.  Had to shake coffee out of the pannier at the end of the tour. Not as easy as it might sound.
Well done.
Air-tight bagging should cut down on how quickly the volatile flavors leave the coffee during storage.

I use a ziplock bag and press all the air out whenever I close it, I have not noticed any deprecation in the taste of the coffee from doing it this way.  But to pack 3 pounds of gear to make coffee is crazy to me, I'm sort of a coffee snob myself, but I'm willing to sacrifice a bit of snobbery to eliminate 3 pounds of gear.  Heck if I was going to be a coffee snob while bike camping, I would rather just take a Nanopresso Espresso maker, that device is only 12 ounces, and the reviews have all said that it makes great espresso; but even 12 ounces I'm willing to cut back from, but the biggest issue is that this device is 6 inches long by 3 inches round, so there's valuable real estate being taking by this device in a pannier.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Westinghouse on December 20, 2021, 03:52:01 pm
Juan Valdez must be beaming with joy at all this.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on December 20, 2021, 03:57:33 pm
But to pack 3 pounds of gear to make coffee is crazy to me

Calculation:

1. Stove.
2. fuel
3. pot
4. coffee.
5. grinder (optional - mine's 300 g)

It all adds up to about 3 pounds.

If you already have the pot, stove and fuel for other reasons, and you're making cowboy coffee, then the only additional weight is that of the coffee.

Juan Valdez must be beaming with joy at all this.
...and his donkey, too.

Right - only tire and frame choices generate more discussion than the politics of coffee.

Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on December 20, 2021, 05:25:43 pm
But to pack 3 pounds of gear to make coffee is crazy to me

Calculation:

1. Stove.
2. fuel
3. pot
4. coffee.
5. grinder (optional - mine's 300 g)

It all adds up to about 3 pounds.

If you already have the pot, stove and fuel for other reasons, and you're making cowboy coffee, then the only additional weight is that of the coffee.   Just the grinder is more than I carry to cook, prepare, and eat my meals.

Juan Valdez must be beaming with joy at all this.
...and his donkey, too.

Right - only tire and frame choices generate more discussion than the politics of coffee.
I absolutely love my coffee even though I am far from a coffee snob.  That said all the fuss over it when on tour baffles me.  I usually don't even bother with making coffee in camp and catch a few cups when I can on the road at second breakfast.  So 3 pounds of stuff including a grinder sounds like a lot to me.  My stove, pot, pot stand, wind screen, and utensils in some cases under 7 ounces when I use the alcohol stove (not counting a few ounces of fuel and I do carry a good bit more when I take other stoves).  My bivy, tarp, stakes, cords, sleeping bag, and pillow along with associated stuffsacks is almosy half a pound under the 3 pounds you mention, so I'd be pretty quick to balk at 3 pounds of stuff for coffee.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 20, 2021, 07:36:07 pm
But to pack 3 pounds of gear to make coffee is crazy to me

Calculation:

1. Stove.
2. fuel
3. pot
4. coffee.
5. grinder (optional - mine's 300 g)

It all adds up to about 3 pounds.

If you already have the pot, stove and fuel for other reasons, and you're making cowboy coffee, then the only additional weight is that of the coffee.

Juan Valdez must be beaming with joy at all this.
...and his donkey, too.

Right - only tire and frame choices generate more discussion than the politics of coffee.

I tried the cowboy thing, it did not turn out good at all, it was nasty!  I don't know what I'm doing wrong, I did it at the house so I would know how to do it out camping, I wasted a lot coffee trying to make cowboy coffee, but I'm not much of a cook either, but I do pretty good making Turkish coffee, which is supposedly almost the same method as Turkish coffee except you boil the water for cowboy coffee whereas you don't boil the water with Turkish.  Anyway, I could not make it right.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on December 21, 2021, 08:29:20 am
Cowboy coffee is easy. Bring measured amount of water to boil - when rolling boil shut off. Add coffee - I use one rounded coffee scoop per 6 oz. of water. Now cover and let steep until the grinds settle to the bottom. Decant from pot to cup to not stir up the grinds. Variations call for adding egg shells to "clarify" the coffee or salt.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 21, 2021, 09:19:33 am
I tried that method for cowboy coffee too, except for the eggshells because I know when I'm camping eggshells will not be around.  I watched a lot of videos on how to make cowboy coffee and this method you mention is the most common but they all tasted nasty.  Maybe it's just my taste preferences?
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on December 21, 2021, 09:36:30 am
I tried that method for cowboy coffee too, except for the eggshells because I know when I'm camping eggshells will not be around.  I watched a lot of videos on how to make cowboy coffee and this method you mention is the most common but they all tasted nasty.  Maybe it's just my taste preferences?
If you really must make coffee in camp why not drip or french press?

The GSI Outdoors Ultralight Java Drip is 11 grams, about $9 and doesn't require paper filters.  There are other similar choices from other brands.

There are a number of choices for french press.  Your cup/pot may have a press option available.  Something like the $$$ Snow Peak Titanium French Press is nice and makes good coffee.

If I were to take something I'd probably opt for the GSI drip one, but I haven't been making coffee on tour on most tours (bought coffee at a diner if available or did without).  Backpacking I used Via on my most recent trips.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on December 21, 2021, 09:36:55 am
I tried that method for cowboy coffee too, except for the eggshells because I know when I'm camping eggshells will not be around.  I watched a lot of videos on how to make cowboy coffee and this method you mention is the most common but they all tasted nasty.  Maybe it's just my taste preferences?
Could be the pot you were using as well. To me aluminum adds a bad taste, and I won't use it for health reasons anyway. I have also used 2 Maxwell House (Folgers if desperate) coffee bags the same way and it is okay. We grind 100% organic Arabica beans at home or I make espresso using Bustillo. I have been drinking more Earl Grey Tea at camp these days. When you get as old as me you wake up at 4:30 AM on your own. :) 
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 21, 2021, 09:56:32 am
I tried that method for cowboy coffee too, except for the eggshells because I know when I'm camping eggshells will not be around.  I watched a lot of videos on how to make cowboy coffee and this method you mention is the most common but they all tasted nasty.  Maybe it's just my taste preferences?
Could be the pot you were using as well. To me aluminum adds a bad taste, and I won't use it for health reasons anyway. I have also used 2 Maxwell House (Folgers if desperate) coffee bags the same way and it is okay. We grind 100% organic Arabica beans at home or I make espresso using Bustillo. I have been drinking more Earl Grey Tea at camp these days. When you get as old as me you wake up at 4:30 AM on your own. :)

I didn't cook it while camping, that would have entailed using an AL pot, but I cooked it at home in a stainless-steel pot.  The doc told me to stay away from tea of any sort because tea contributes to the production of kidney stones which I had a problem with, note I said had, I was getting a stone about every 6 months, the doc gave me a diet plan and since then I've haven't had one stone, it's been 5 years since I got my last stone.   I use Bustillo as well for my espresso, but I do change it up too from using Lavazza Super Cream Espresso to, Kirkland Signature Starbucks Espresso because I can get that stuff locally, but I can also get and I tried Peets and it wasn't good at all, and the other I can get is Death Wish, but I can't justify spending $20 for a small bag of coffee which is why I don't go to the local roasters in town either because they run $20 and up for small bags.  I'm sort of cheap!  LOL!!!  I did one time to see what it was like and splurged and got a bag of fresh roasted espresso from that local roaster place, it was good, but not remarkably so, not enough to justify the expense.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on December 22, 2021, 08:15:32 am
Okay so I think I may have mentioned earlier that I was going to try Alpine Start instant after reading a very positive review.  I had bought some a while back and finally got around to trying it.  I bought the 8 pack of Original Blend medium roast and it works out to about a buck a cup.

It wasn't bad to my taste.  I found it hard to describe, the best description I came up with is "unremarkable" which actually isn't bad when it comes to instant coffe which I usually have at lesat some negative comment about.  I can't say I love it, but I don't dislike it.  One might say that for $1 a cup I ought to really like it and that may be true, but instant generally sucks.  If you want something that hits you over the head with flavor this isn't it, but it isn't terrible.

Compared to Starbucks Via I think maybe I like Alpine just a little better, but both are okay.  Via is more readily available and can be found cheaper though.  Both are 1000x better than the Nescafe packets that I tried a few years ago.  The Nescafe was cheaper, but sadly it wasn't fit to drink IMO.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: BikeliciousBabe on December 22, 2021, 09:26:55 am
Compared to Starbucks Via I think maybe I like Alpine just a little better, but both are okay.  Via is more readily available and can be found cheaper though.  Both are 1000x better than the Nescafe packets that I tried a few years ago.  The Nescafe was cheaper, but sadly it wasn't fit to drink IMO.

I tried Via for a while before I got a portable French press.  Not for me.

Do you know if they still make those coffee "tea bags"?  We tried them back in '99 early on during our Northern Tier group tour.  You made coffee with them just as you would tea.  I think they were from Folgers.  They were awful.  I think we ended up tossing them because people would rather drink nothing than that stuff.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on December 22, 2021, 09:34:34 am
Compared to Starbucks Via I think maybe I like Alpine just a little better, but both are okay.  Via is more readily available and can be found cheaper though.  Both are 1000x better than the Nescafe packets that I tried a few years ago.  The Nescafe was cheaper, but sadly it wasn't fit to drink IMO.

I tried Via for a while before I got a portable French press.  Not for me.
To be clear...  I am calibrating this as instant coffee and not really comparing to "real" coffee.  None of the instants are especially good as far as I know.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on December 22, 2021, 10:08:50 am
I try to steer clear of both instant and Starbucks (Love dark roast but hate burnt beans). The combination of Starbucks and Instant would be a hard pass for me.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: staehpj1 on December 22, 2021, 10:21:11 am
I try to steer clear of both instant and Starbucks (Love dark roast but hate burnt beans). The combination of Starbucks and Instant would be a hard pass for me.
I too hate burned beans and avoid Starbucks in general, but decent instant is so scarce to nonexistent that I am willing to drink Via at times despite hating Starbucks in general.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: ray b on December 22, 2021, 06:25:37 pm
I try to steer clear of both instant and Starbucks (Love dark roast but hate burnt beans). The combination of Starbucks and Instant would be a hard pass for me.
I too hate burned beans and avoid Starbucks in general, but decent instant is so scarce to nonexistent that I am willing to drink Via at times despite hating Starbucks in general.
Ahhh. Charbucks. Fortunately, their stores are located in towns big enough to have a competing local roaster or coffee shop down the street.

I now note four pages of comments about "coffee coffee...." At this point in the thread, I'd ask why so much coffee on the trail? 

For me, the taste of a good French roast or espresso is like chocolate, and the routine of morning coffee makes me feel civilized.

That said, does it do anything for my mental alertness and physical capacity?

Well, not after 20 min on the bike. Once adrenaline levels are up, and muscles and joints are running on all cylinders, the caffeine adds nothing. Of course, if it's cold and one's going to sit around camp and has perhaps put off getting out of bed and breaking down the tent until after coffee, then I see the purpose of a little warmth and chemical stimulation. Although coffee and cycling just seem to go together - and especially at the shops where adrenaline junkies are forced to sit around wrenching for a living - the fact of the matter is that coffee doesn't add anything other than esthetic value to our ride. After 20 minutes on the bike, the daily dose of caffeine is meaningless. (No need to cite the studies on rectal caffeine and effects of coffee on fatty acid to carbohydrate metabolism in caffeine-naive subjects. In subjects regularly exposed to caffeine, there should be no significant difference in efficiency or performance while touring at 50-70% max for 5-6 h.)

Something a lot of us already understand - if we can throw the stuff on the bike and start riding, we feel pretty good after about 20 minutes. During the hot months, an hour ride before breakfast
with a good sunrise is a great chemical and esthetic substitute for coffee. We don't really need the caffeine and coffee itself provides no nutrition.

Now, if you want to know how I came to occasionally carry a camp espresso boiler, let's consider the esthetics of sunrise in a 4-foot deep winter mountaineering camp surrounded by snow ghosts, with a small white china cup of espresso steaming on an icy white shelf of snow.  That was worth the otherwise worthless weight of the coffee and aluminum espresso pot.

I like the discussion of coffee, but before mindlessly packing our usual, pre-office, morning routine onto our bikes, I encourage folks to think about why they do it and what they get out of a drink with no calories and less stimulation than riding. Most of us don't need it as much as we are led to believe.

'Nuf said. Time to finish my afternoon coffee and ride....
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 22, 2021, 07:28:16 pm
I tried that method for cowboy coffee too, except for the eggshells because I know when I'm camping eggshells will not be around.  I watched a lot of videos on how to make cowboy coffee and this method you mention is the most common but they all tasted nasty.  Maybe it's just my taste preferences?
If you really must make coffee in camp why not drip or french press?

The GSI Outdoors Ultralight Java Drip is 11 grams, about $9 and doesn't require paper filters.  There are other similar choices from other brands.

There are a number of choices for french press.  Your cup/pot may have a press option available.  Something like the $$$ Snow Peak Titanium French Press is nice and makes good coffee.

If I were to take something I'd probably opt for the GSI drip one, but I haven't been making coffee on tour on most tours (bought coffee at a diner if available or did without).  Backpacking I used Via on my most recent trips.

I did mention in an earlier post that I ended up first trying an AeroPress but found it too bulky, so then I found the GSI Ultralight pour over and this is PERFECT, extremely lightweight and it takes hardly any space, and it makes a decent enough coffee for camping.  Its only drawback is due to it being so light I'm careful with the slide on fasteners that attach the legs to the cup, I'm afraid those could snap, but it's cheap so even if it broke it wouldn't be a big deal.  Oh, no paper filters are needed, you put the coffee grinds in, pour hot water slowly over the grinds, once all done just flip it inside out and shake the grinds out, then rinse with water.  I just put the grinds on the grass, it's good for the grass.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Westinghouse on December 22, 2021, 08:19:00 pm
McDonald’s has some kind of coffee. Starbucks coffee tasted different from McDonald’s. The small coffee shops brew The best coffee. They brew up a mean cup of coffee in Ukraine. East coastal Italy had excellent coffee. I could not stop drinking it, and I rarely slept. As for myself, I am not what you would call a coffee drinker. I drink it occasionally I actually rarely and when I do I Keep it to the minimum.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 22, 2021, 09:41:26 pm
McDonald’s has some kind of coffee. Starbucks coffee tasted different from McDonald’s. The small coffee shops brew The best coffee. They brew up a mean cup of coffee in Ukraine. East coastal Italy had excellent coffee. I could not stop drinking it, and I rarely slept. As for myself, I am not what you would call a coffee drinker. I drink it occasionally I actually rarely and when I do I Keep it to the minimum.

When McDonalds first came out with coffee, and for about 10 years after that they had the most unique tasting coffee that got rave reviews with some people saying it was better than Starbucks, but then for some reason about 10 years ago they changed the coffee to a regular type of coffee.  McDonalds still makes espresso though, but you have to ask for it because it's not on the menu anymore.   The best espresso I ever had was at an Italian restaurant in San Francisco, I can't recall the name of the place, but the espresso was like having dessert.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Westinghouse on December 23, 2021, 05:03:08 pm
It is a cold cold winter morning on the southern tier. You roll out of your tent. You pack, push the bike out to the road, and set out. You come to someplace that sells coffee. It could be a coffee shop, Denny’s, Burger King, Starbucks, McDonald’s, Or the local small town diner. That’s when coffee a hot cup of coffee really hits the spot. Generally speaking I am far from being a coffee hound. Some people revel And scarfing up coffee all day long.  That’s not me.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: BikeliciousBabe on December 27, 2021, 10:26:14 am
I almost always limit my coffee intake to mornings, but that doesn't mean I want to wait until I am on the road, especially when it's cold.  My goal each morning is to at least start heating the water before I have to "hit the head."   ;D
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: jamawani on December 27, 2021, 11:44:48 am
Is coffee addictive ??  ;-)
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on December 27, 2021, 11:53:09 am
Is coffee addictive ??  ;-)

I would say quite considering the 4 pages of discussion :)
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: canalligators on December 27, 2021, 12:41:31 pm
Is coffee addictive ??  ;-)

Yes, mild physical addiction, but withdrawal for most people causes little more than a headache and only lasts a day or so.  My problem is, I still work on a self-indulgence model. And being a diabetic, coffee gives me a self-indulgence that’s zero carb.  Now if I can get my digestion to tolerate more than one cup a day…

Coffee seems to work well for a lot of recovering alcoholics.  Lesser of two evils, for sure.

Caffeine is a trigger for many migraine sufferers.  Beware.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on December 27, 2021, 01:04:32 pm
Is coffee addictive ??  ;-)
Caffeine is a trigger for many migraine sufferers.  Beware.

Caffeine can also alleviate headaches and is used in medications like Excedrin. https://www.excedrin.com/dosage-ingredients-chart/excedrin-and-caffeine/ (https://www.excedrin.com/dosage-ingredients-chart/excedrin-and-caffeine/)
Also, the darker roasts typically have lower acid than the lighter roasts, so switching to a darker roast may help your stomach issues.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on December 27, 2021, 02:04:57 pm
The caffeine in coffee, if you drink it every day for how long? I don't know, but it can lead to headaches once you stop, so that day that you don't have coffee you will have a headache, and you will have a headache every day for about a week to 2 weeks.  Due to that happening to me I now only drink coffee once every other to every 3rd day.

Headache medicines like Excedrin have caffeine it to help speed up the delivery of the meds.  While you could treat a headache brought on by cutting coffee with Excedrin, all you are really doing is still taking caffeine, so you're not getting off the caffeine addiction by taking Excedrin.

As far as acid goes, yes, dark roast has less acid and less caffeine than light roast.  However, the least amount of acid you can get, besides going to low acid roast, is cold brew, cold brew coffee made by steeping the coffee grounds for 12 or so hours, not by cooking the coffee then pouring it over ice method, the steeping method reduces acid by an estimated 60% over cooking.

The other interesting thing is, it is a well-known fact that caffeine can improve the performance of a cyclist, as well as other sports, BUT, if you drink caffeine (coffee) every day your body gets use to the caffeine intake and you won't see any performance improvement, the only way that works for performance is if you rarely drink coffee or any other caffeine product.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: HikeBikeCook on December 27, 2021, 02:53:48 pm
Many sports snacks (Cliff Shot Bloks) and sport drinks contain caffeine as well.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on January 01, 2022, 01:47:23 am
But to pack 3 pounds of gear to make coffee is crazy to me

Calculation:

1. Stove.
2. fuel
3. pot
4. coffee.
5. grinder (optional - mine's 300 g)

It all adds up to about 3 pounds.


The stove I carry weighs 91 grams, a full fuel can weighs 220 grams, you can't count the pot because the pot is used for other cooking stuff, but for sake of argument the pot weighs 50 grams, weight of the coffee is a bit tricky, but I take somewhere around 10 tablespoons of coffee so about 50 grams of coffee, and I don't take a grinder, so that's around 411 grams rounded it up to 450 grams for error is only one pound, where you get 3 pounds from I don't know.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: Scotty0424 on January 06, 2022, 09:23:59 am
Melita makes a lightweight plastic cone, which, equipped with a paper filter, fits onto a mug. Hot water is poured over coffee in the filer and decent coffee drips into the mug. It's lightweight and a good alternative to other methods. In a pinch, Starbucks makes little instant coffee packets called Via. Could be worse.
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: froze on January 06, 2022, 12:30:59 pm
Melita makes a lightweight plastic cone, which, equipped with a paper filter, fits onto a mug. Hot water is poured over coffee in the filer and decent coffee drips into the mug. It's lightweight and a good alternative to other methods. In a pinch, Starbucks makes little instant coffee packets called Via. Could be worse.

It can't get much worse than instant coffee! 

Problem with a plastic cone is that it doesn't fold flat thus takes up space, plus you need to carry paper filters which not only weigh a little bit but they also take up space.  The GSI Ultralight folds flat and then fits under a fuel cannister so it completely takes up no space, and it requires no paper filters. 
Title: Re: coffee coffee
Post by: loonyy on May 17, 2022, 11:43:34 pm
Agree with the others about using press, that is the easiest way of making coffee for me. Also, if you like creamer, I found this (https://coffeehustle.org/coffee-creamer/#product_3) one - this is powder (keeps long) and have a convinient package so it does not take up a lot of space.

For boiling water I use a little stove which is also light-weight.

Enjoy your coffee!