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Messages - paddleboy17

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Gear Talk / Re: Getting bike and gear to start of tour
« on: September 26, 2016, 03:16:40 pm »

I have always thought Greyhound Freight was interesting.  They ship from one Greyhound bus depot to another bus depot.  It has been a while, but Greyhound was pretty flexible on box size--it just has to be low enough to fit in a cargo hold.

Just because it is a Greyhound bus station don't count on it being a station that will accept or receive a bike, and if does one, don't count on it doing the other; my experience.

From Greyhound's point of view, the bike box is just freight.  You of course need a box, and I don't know what happens if a Greyhound staffer flops the box on its side and pile crap on top of it.  I think you have to factor in extra time in case the box has to switch buses too.  I got the impression that freight goes stand by, but there is usually room.

The last time I looked into this, I was going from Detroit to Buffalo, with a bus change in Pittsburgh.  Like I said, it is interesting...

Gear Talk / Re: Getting bike and gear to start of tour
« on: September 26, 2016, 01:44:46 pm »
I have shipped FedEx ground a couple of times. The trick is getting a box shaped so as to not be flagged as over sized.  A bike box is over sized, a frame box is not.

I have always thought Greyhound Freight was interesting.  They ship from one Greyhound bus depot to another bus depot.  It has been a while, but Greyhound was pretty flexible on box size--it just has to be low enough to fit in a cargo hold.

I always wanted to travel by Amtrak, it just has never worked out for me.  Some routes even have roll on/off service.

Time out boys...

I think being able to replace AA or AAA batteries at any gas station is a useful thing.    Chargers take space, and finding opportunities to charge is a pain.  Plus what happens if you need your lights and you guessed wrong on your charge level.  You cannot always head to the nearest McDonalds to hang out in their lobby while you wait for your light's batteries to recharge.  Having your phone go dead is one thing.  Being able to run the lights in blink mode in inclement weather or light the way if you are running late is pretty important.

Gear Talk / Re: Fixing panniers
« on: August 18, 2016, 12:29:35 pm »
Tenacious Tape may be worth trying.

I was going to suggest duck tape (or is it duct tape),  but this looks far superior.  Maybe we should all have some tenacious tape in our kits.

Gear Talk / Re: Terry Touring Bikes - Coto Doñana Tour
« on: August 16, 2016, 02:24:02 pm »
When I looked at the bike specs, it does say 20.5 pounds without pedals.

If you can afford the trip, I think a factory trip might be in order.  I would be very surprised if you could not visit the factory and meet with someone.  You might not get Georgina Terry, but you should get the time and attention from someone competent.

As for the custom issue...

The Georgina Terry bike has a hand welded frame as opposed to a mass welded frame from Taiwan.  I don't remember the component mix on the LHT and what is currently on the bike you were looking at.  Plus I can't check them right now, so I am no help to you there.  There are a lot of poorly conceived and poorly executed touring bikes out there.  The LHT has a good reputation, but I have never ridden one.  And as I said earlier, I have no idea how Georgina Terry does her bike for 20.5 pounds.  I don't think that if you  bought a Gunnar and build it up yourself, that you would end up with a budget Georgina Terry bike.  You should probably look at Rivendell too (also Waterford frames).  They are on the west coast if that is more convenient for a road trip.

I have a Waterford frame.  I got it, because I had a poorly conceived and executed touring bike.  My original touring bike wiggled with panniers, and was a disaster.  It was a great dirt road ride though.  I can get my Waterford frame to flex, but it immediately dampens out all vibration.  I put good stuff on it, and it stickered out at $5200 (frame was $2300).  The ride is fabulous.

Most bike dealers do not carry touring bikes, so there may not be an LHT in your size to test ride either. 

I think Georgina Terry's set up is in New York, so if you can arrange the trip you should.  I know of someone who spent an afternoon at Co-Motion in Oregon, and someone who spent an afternoon with Seven in Massachusetts.  At one point, my buddies and I were going to make a road trip to Waterford in Wisconsin, but it never happened.

Gear Talk / Re: Terry Touring Bikes - Coto Doñana Tour
« on: August 16, 2016, 01:14:19 pm »
Russ, thanks I had not really priced the Gunnar frames/forks, etc. I don't think the 480 frame will work for me (too big) but I should compare the specs with the Terry and LHT and also contact Gunnar, especially if I can save $$.

I compared the Gunnar and Terry websites for the bikes.  It appears Terry has Gunnar make them different sized bikes from the stock Gunnar bikes.  Terry does offer one smaller bike than the smallest Gunnar frame.  You might go custom with Gunnar and work with them to make a smaller frame similar to the smallest Terry frame.  Terry gives you its dimensions.  I'm sort of, kind of against the Terry bicycle simply because it is a Gunnar frame.  Terry even says its a Waterford (Gunnar) frame.  So why not skip the middle man (Terry) and buy the frame from its real maker (Waterford/Gunnar)?

Another person argues against buying a frame and building it yourself because the cost is usually more than buying it direct already built as a complete bike.  With the Terry it is very easy to see if this is true or not.  Terry says it is a Gunnar frame/fork.  Gunnar sells its frames direct to the public and lists its prices.  Price both the standard and custom options.  Terry also lists all the parts on the bike.  Simple to find all those parts on the internet and list their prices.  See if the totals work out right or wrong.  Biggest benefit for building it yourself is you get to pick every part yourself and get what you want.  Not accept a half-arse part you don't want.  Like 32 spokes instead of 36 for a loaded touring wheel.  ???  Or lower and better mid range gearing than what Terry offers.  An 11-36 cassette instead of the 11-34 Terry offers.  A 42-32-22 crankset instead of the 48-34-24 crankset Terry offers.  Wider handlebars.  Correct stem length.  Saddle that fits you.  By the time you pay to change all these parts on a stock bike, its probably better and cheaper to buy it right from the beginning.

I am pretty sure that all the custom frames are Waterford and all the stock frames are Gunnar.  So there is no custom Gunnar.  A Gunnar is always TIG welded, and a Waterford could be TIG welded or lugged (silver soldered).  And if the frames are the same size, and come from the same tube sets, and are both TIG welded, then why is the Gunnar less expensive and is it better than the Waterford frame?  Waterford frames are done one at a time, and Gunnar frames are done in batches.  This is sort of like comparing machine built wheels with custom wheels, done to the the same rim, spokes, and hubs.  Should you not know, there is more attention to details (like spoke tension) in a custom wheel.

I used to be an automotive engineer, so I will throw out an analogy.  Back when cars were more generic, a model might be available as a Ford, a Mercury, or a Lincoln.  So you could find a Ford with the same trim level as Lincoln, and the Ford would cost less than the Lincoln.  I was in engine engineering, so I can't speak to all of the differences between a Ford and a Lincoln, but a Lincoln had to always start on the first crank--a Ford was allowed to stall once.

I would bet that these are Waterford frames done to Georgina's specifications, which includes a smaller frame size than is available from Gunnar.

I want to know how she gets the weight down to 20.5 pounds (does include saddle, does not include pedals, does not include racks).  I think she is making assumptions about a woman's more petite weight, as I would not normally spec a 32 spoke wheel in a touring bike.  Georgina is a pretty straight shooter and has long held a good reputation.  I am more incline to trust Georgina, than I am to trust Trek or Specialized or any of the other big bike companies.

I think our original poster has a misguided perspective on weight.  The frame normally accounts for 4-5 pounds (for a quality steel frame) out of the total weight of the bike.  The rest of that weight comes from the components and wheels.  I would expect a steel touring bike to come in at 23-25 pounds (no racks or fenders).  I don't know why the LHT is 28 pounds.  Maybe the frames are heavier due to the using single butted tube sets able to dampen on frame flex on a loaded bike.  I seem to remember an LHT frame and fork is ~$700, so there has to be reasons why it is $1100 cheaper than a Gunnar.  Sure the welder in Wisconsin gets paid more than one in Taiwan, but shipping cost are down too.

A loaded touring bike is not going to be nimble and it is not going to be quick and that just needs to be accepted.  One can spend $1200 on an LHT and get this and $3500 on a custom bike and get that.  The weight of the load can be reduced by eating out and/or not camping.  Life is full of tradeoffs.

General Discussion / Re: SPD Cleats-SH51 Versus SH56?
« on: August 11, 2016, 01:00:03 pm »
I like the SH56 multi-release cleats for mountain biking.  I used to have a more aggressive riding style and like the assurance that they would release when I got launched over the handle bars during and endo.

The stock SH51 cleats are more than adequate for road riding and touring.

Gear Talk / Re: The Newer Cro-Mo Steel Frames
« on: August 01, 2016, 01:12:03 pm »
The facts are there already folks.  Makers such as trek, surly, salsa and others are stating bikes are made from Cro-Mo steel and laymen such as the people who have responded to my post believe that all Cro-Mo steels are the same.  The fact is that without some sort of certification I can call anything I want to cro-Mo steel.  And the cro-mo steel they are using has no certifications.  Those are the facts like it or not.  I'm not a conspiracy theorist.  Uncertified cro-Mo steel is not a commodity item.  I guess I'm living in a fantasy world called, "reality". 

Some of the responses to this post are WAY out in left field and just not worth answering.

Surly advertises 4130 which is the generic SAE standard for Cro-Mo steel.  I think Surly does that so they can competitively source tubing from the various manufacturers.

Reynolds, Tange, and TrueTemper all make products that are more specialized but are still 4130 Cro-Mo steel.  I know the Reynolds line best as they have steels for silver soldering and steels for TIG welding.  Some of it is stiff and some of it is less stiff.  Some of it is single butted and some of it is double butted, but it is all still 4130.

I for one wish Surly would go into more detail about where there tube sets come from, as 531 and 520 would make a wiggly touring bike but 831 would not.

General Discussion / Re: Bike selection help
« on: August 01, 2016, 12:54:30 pm »
If you area talking about the Adventure Cycling Great Divide Mountain Bike Route, then I have some useful comments...

If you are talking some other route then what I have to say may not apply.

I rode a portion in New Mexico and it was at worst two track.  Lots of washboard, which was the compelling reason to ride a mountain bike.  I used a Bob trailer and it worked out.  I think Bob trailers have a tendency to bounce and others disagree.  I do not think I would have liked panniers (I use panniers now on road).  Ride some washboard and decide if you like 26", 27.5", 29", or fat mountain bike.  I rode a 26" steel hard tailed with front suspension.

Gear Talk / Re: Bike - Light Duty Touring Aluminum vs. Steel
« on: July 14, 2016, 12:57:41 pm »
A couple of thoughts to guide you.

If you go the trailer route, i recommend a longer wheel base bike.

A loaded bike will be pigish compared to an unloaded bike.  As other have noted, you want to do a lot of different things and no bike will do them all well.  You will have to make concessions and compromises.  Touring bikes do not always ride well unloaded either (I like mine fine, but I have heard others complain). 

Gear Talk / Re: saddles and sores
« on: June 17, 2016, 05:04:21 pm »

You skimmed when you should have read.

A few years back, I participated in an event ride, and I rode my beloved Paramount, aka the zippy fast bike.  15 miles into a 65 mile ride, a torrential ride dumped an amazing quantity of rain in 20 minutes.  There was indeed a rooster tail of water, and while I did have a saddlebag, my saddle did get really wet too.  I have always used proof hide on the top and bottom of the saddle.  By the end of the ride, I could hardly believe the damage done to my saddle.   Once the saddle dried out naturally, a week later I might add, I was able to retention the saddle and take up most of the stretch.  There are few disturbing looking stretch marks, that have not done any lasting damage.  If the saddle ever gets wet like his again though, it will be a lost cause. 

The amount of moisture coming off of my backside spread over the area of my backside is trivial.

Gear Talk / Re: saddles and sores
« on: June 16, 2016, 12:52:55 pm »
It is not my damp shorts that I worry about. 

I worry about the rooster tail of water coming up from my zippy fast bike (no fenders) that saturates the underside of the saddle.  That is why I am experimenting with a Cambrium on it.  My touring bike has fenders, so no rooster tail of water to deal with.

But your butt covers the top of the saddle enough to protect it generally from rain.

Gear Talk / Re: bike suggestion
« on: June 02, 2016, 12:57:15 pm »
There used to be some concern about disk brakes on touring bikes.  Something about them not being able to deal with the extra heat from the weight of a loaded touring bike.  Tandems used to come with a drum brake for that reason.  I do not know if a tandem capable disk brake has been developed and if it trickled down to LHTs or not.

There is generally nothing wrong with rim brakes.

Gear Talk / Re: saddles and sores
« on: June 02, 2016, 12:49:57 pm »
Selle Anatomica saddles function like twin hammocks, one for each butt cheek.  Their synthetic leather stretches, so Selle Anatomica saddles are more of a consumable than an investment.

With a traditional Brooks saddle, you have a solid mass with a dent for each pelvic bone.  The saddle reshapes to match the profile of your body.  When you add a cutout to a Brooks saddle, some structural integrity is lost.  That is why the Brooks Imperials come laced.  If you remove the lacing, then I think you get some hammock action, but not nearly as pronounces as a Selle Anatomica saddle.

So as to what is right for you.

Infected hair follicles sound like a hygiene issue.  Maybe you have to be paranoid level diligent.

Comfort wise, maybe a Team Pro is best for you.  They take forever to break in as their leather is thicker.  I did not pick up on if you need a prostate friendly cut out or not.  If you get an Imperial variant, leave the laces alone.  Personally I like the cutout shaped used by Selle Anatomica better than the Brooks Imperial shape.  Monarch Leather is the leather vendor for Selle Anatomica, and they will add a cutout to a Brooks saddle.  When it was $50/saddle, I sent to saddles to them to be cut down.  Once they raised their rate to $100/saddle, I decided to cut my own saddle.  I will have to punch holes for lacing in the near future, as I see a need for that.

Lastly, some leather colors are stiffer than others.  Black is the stiffest, and honey is the softest, and I do not know about the other colors.

I am currently learning to ride a Cabrium C-17 on one of my bikes.  So far I think it is a harsher ride than my leather saddles.  Nose angle seems to be more important.  Ask me at the end of the summer if I kept it or went back to a leather B-17.

Gear Talk / Re: Brooks saddle and bike shorts
« on: June 02, 2016, 12:16:45 pm »
Your saddle may be over tensioned.  There should be a hint of sag, from front to back.  You might also have someone check the fit, when the fit is "right" you tush will neutral for front to back movement.

You have a natural product, so your leather may just be a little harder than normal. Black saddles are harder than honey saddles, it is a function of the dye.  Once your butt forms those tell tale ruts, you will stop sliding around.

Most Brooks leather saddles should show signs of breaking in after 8 hours of riding.  I have owned 5 of them, and that is what 4 of them did.  I had a Team Pro that took all summer to break in.

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