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Messages - jrobertson

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The Hay Creek Fire closure has been rescinded as of 8/24:

the Great Divide Section 1 is now open across the Whitefish Range.

It appears that US20 is now open with reduced speed and delays due to wildfire activity, but it IS NO LONGER CLOSED as of 8/10/21.

Thank you both for the additional information here. There is definitely some conflicting information. We heard from multiple people, including someone who actually talked to the MDOT employees when they were passing through and we're told "you're the last one's through, we're welding it shut". So, it's good to hear that it is not in fact welded and still possible to complete the I-15 Alternate.

Montana DOT has deemed the "Tunnel #9" (mile 4.8 southbound) on the I-15 alternate unsafe and welded steel grates across the tunnel. This makes the I-15 alternate impassable. The options are either to use the Main Route, or to ride I-15 the whole way between Butte and I-15 Exit #151/Junction with Boulder River Rd. See attached map.

The Hay Creek Fire in the whitefish range has closed the red meadow road (FSR 115).
inciweb incident:
closure map:

At this time we recommend using US 93 to get around this section between Eureka and Whitefish. There is a rumor that there is more fire activity on the Upper Whitefish Road, but we do not have any official information yet.

These look like great options too. Thanks!

That is a great addition jamawani! It sounds like the best option for NT (EB) is the Centennial Trail>PTCT>Wenatchee>SR 28 until you meet back up with US2 to rejoin the NT route in Newport, WA. Just a reminder that the I-90 bridge is not at all suitable for cycling.

This closure could be around for awhile. For riders on the Washington Parks route, it is a closure without a viable detour. For Northern Tier riders, A very large detour is possible via our Washington Parks Sections 1 and 2 (Going south around Olympia to Wenatchee and then and SR 2 between Wenatchee, WA and Newport, passing through Spokane. Note that SR2 will be carrying increased traffic due to the SR20 closure.

For riders looking to do a more direct route and making the start/end Seattle instead of Anacortes, the PTCT ( ), a firmly packed gravel trail, is an option to get to Lauderdale Junction (Washington Parks Section 2, map 20). rwgps route:

GPS & Digital Data Discussion / Re: GPS query
« on: February 19, 2021, 02:42:40 pm »
Hi Ray - The Bicycle Route Navigator app (powered by FrontPack) isn't directly supported by any third party platform like RWGPS or Wahoo. Those in-app map section purchases in the BRN app can only be used there. This is the best option for folks who don't want to mess with file management or having a phone and a gps unit. But for people who really want the handlebar-mounted gps  experience, we offer the gpx data packages on our website for the same map sections. This data is the same that is in the BRN app, just workable on a number of platforms that support gpx files (almost all do). Here are some instructions for getting gpx data on a wahoo:

Jamie Robertson

Routes / Re: ACA Discontinuing some Paper Maps
« on: November 12, 2020, 01:19:32 pm »
Finally, to your point about reroutes, we have already implemented route changes on the the digital-only sections that would have required a major overhaul on the paper maps, so this compromise allows us to provide the best routing while not incurring the additional time and overhead it would have taken to implement such a change for a route that is only utilized by a few cyclists every year.
So you are saying that every map you can getting rid of has had route changes?  If so, how is this any different than doing the addendum used before the map is reprinted?  Additionally, I thought that ACA starting to use GIS was going to make changes easily so this very excuse would not occur.

If there are changes, why not use the aforementioned "trusted users" to do the actual work for ACA?  Again, at least two highly experienced users have suggested and volunteered to do it but only crickets have responded. 

If there are NO changes, why not do a pdf? Surely, there is very little cost to convert to a pdf.  Or for that matter, what costs are there to keep a map?  As others have mentioned, if the cost exceeds the income, just increase the cost of the map to the user?

ACA over the past several years has steadily drifted away from its primary purpose, i.e. you were primarily a bicycle route creator.  All this other stuff that has been added onto over the years has eroded the true purpose of ACA. 

Sincerely, John

John, thank you for your comments. The map sections that we have converted to digital-only so far have had significant route changes. I'm not sure about all of them as they are due for updates in the coming year. The addenda we provide does work to provide updates to changes is services, closures, and very small route changes, but it becomes far more complicated when we actually update a map section. Often the geography itself is a limiting factor when we are updating a print map. A map sheet is 19x25" on many of our routes, map panels are 3.5x6" @ 1:250,000, and they all have to link together with overlaps. If a proposed reroute requires extra panels, we have to determine what can be cut to make room for those panels and how it will all be laid out on the sheet. Sometimes this just isn't possible without creating an additional map section all together. We are pretty good at squeezing things in and making reroutes work, but sometimes the geography itself makes it impossible without creating an entirely new map section. And unless there are 12-15 new panels, then it doesn't make sense to add an entire section.

Creating maps with GIS-driven data is definitely a productivity boost, but going from the data itself to the carefully crafted map panels that you expect on our maps is still a lot of time consuming work. I'm sure you've seen your share of poor maps that have been 'spit out' of a GIS, and how different they are from our route maps. Increasing the cost for the map sections could help, but we commonly get feedback that the current cost is a barrier for some people, so that is a balance we need to reach as well. The real limiting factor is actual staff time. X cartographers x 115 map sections x 52 weeks a year means that we can only address a certain number of map sections in a given year. At this time, those limited hours simply have to be focused on map sections used heavily that are in need of attention. I wish we could implement all of the fantastic routing suggestions that we receive from our members, and we surely do for many of them. I'm sorry that you didn't get feedback about your offer of volunteer work, please reach out to me directly at jrobertson at I'd like to talk with you about that.

Your concern over the direction of ACA is well taken. We do believe that it is important to work comprehensively to improve cycling conditions and to inspire people from all walks of life to experience the transformational power of bicycle travel while still holding true to our commitment to provide maps and routing resources that drive those experiences. I can assure you that this change is limited in scope and we will continue to maintain our maps and routes, both paper and digital, going forward.

Jamie Robertson

Routes / Re: ACA Discontinuing some Paper Maps
« on: November 12, 2020, 11:55:35 am »
Some friends and I were originally planning to do the Pacific Coast this past summer (COVID casualty) and we found the weather and daylight hours info helpful for planning. Of course, this data is available elsewhere, but the ACA maps makes it more convenient.
Using the app I am sure some (most?  all?) of the same info is available.  Can someone who has used the app with the digital maps comment on what the app omits that the paper maps provide?

If you can operate in airplane mode to save battery and have all the info available it might not be as bad as i have imagined.  I'd still much prefer to have paper available though.

The Bicycle Route Navigator (BRN) app does have an active weather and NOAA hazards layer which gives point forecasts and current weather for stations in close proximity to the route. The BRN app also has the critical riding conditions that appear on the paper maps. All of the same service information is also included within the BRN app sections. The main omissions are the narrative turn-by-turn directions and the field notes. We are working to include these features in future releases of the BRN app as time and resources allow. Turning off your cell radio (airplane mode) is a great way to conserve your battery while still allowing your GPS radio in your phone to function.

Routes / Re: ACA Discontinuing some Paper Maps
« on: November 12, 2020, 11:47:45 am »
John and others here, thank you for your posts and concern about ACA transitioning a few of our routes to digital-only offerings. It was not a decision that we took lightly. We targeted the slowest selling routes in order to minimize the impact on our members and the cycling community at large. At this time we do not anticipate transitioning any of our other map sections to digital-only releases. We are experiencing hard times right now, and with over 100 printed maps to maintain, we simply had to focus our limited time and resources to make sure we could stay on top of the other maps that are more popular and need attention. We strive to provide the most accurate maps that we can, and we see reducing the shelf time of a given map printing as an important aspect of that goal. Creating print maps is a time intensive and expensive endeavor and unfortunately printing very small quantities is not cost effective. While offering a PDF version of a map seems like it would be the ideal compromise, getting to the point of having the PDF of the quality we all know and love requires all of the work that a paper map would, and at that point it would make sense to print the map after putting in that much effort. We also believe it would be a disservice to provide PDF's of the outdated maps as things have changed so much since they were printed that we can't stand behind that routing in perpetuity.

Finally, to your point about reroutes, we have already implemented route changes on the the digital-only sections that would have required a major overhaul on the paper maps, so this compromise allows us to provide the best routing while not incurring the additional time and overhead it would have taken to implement such a change for a route that is only utilized by a few cyclists every year.

This is new territory for Adventure Cycling. I can assure you that we are all print map lovers here in the department and will work to maintain them. We encourage your feedback, understanding, and patience as we navigate this change in our department.

 Between Ranny Road and Pollock Road (3 to 7 miles south of the Riggins area). The road is closed. There's been a rock fall. Expect delays.

Web Comment: US 95 is currently closed from milepost 186 to milepost 190, which is approximately 2.5 miles north of Pollock to 1.5 miles south of Pollock. There is a local detour in place from 6:00AM PDT until 8:00PM PDT (7:00AM MDT until 9:00PM MDT) until further notice. Alternating one way traffic on a gravel road. Expect delays of up to 30 minutes.

More information here:

Due to torrential rains and 2 failed dams, it is likely that riding through this area will be impossible for awhile.

Rockfall mitigation construction project will cause 20 minute delays on SR 4 near milepost 50.

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