Ludlow to Needles

[The Kansan]

Hello All! What's the scoop on eastbound, Ludlow to Needles? I-40 all the way (are there roads parallel to the I-40)? NTH through Amboy? Cut up north right after Amboy? How many bridges out? Spoke with both the CHP and the San Bernardino "roads" folks, and no real answers. Thanks!

[John Nettles]

Welcome to the ACA Forums!

While I am not 100% sure, I am pretty sure that bikes are prohibited on that stretch of I-40. IIRC, there are "bikes must exit" signs at 115.  Take CA-66 (old US-66) between Exit 115 & Exit 50.  I am pretty sure there is a bridge out on CA-66 but you should be able to get around it as it is a arroyo so long as it is not raining.  The good news is that you should have almost zero traffic. 

Be sure to carry plenty of water/food as I think Amboy has the only food source and I would call ahead to verify it will be open if you are depending on it.
Tailwinds, John

[ExploreEnthusiast]

For going east on I-40 from Ludlow to Needles, the road is usually open. But conditions can change fast, so it’s smart to keep checking for updates. There are some parallel ways, like US-66, but it’s mostly for looking around and not the quickest. You can go NTH through Amboy if you want to take a longer way, and if you turn north after Amboy, you'll find smaller roads which may be less dependable. About bridges, some problems have come up. Maybe better to look at live updates or local traffic news for the best info. Travel safe!

[The Kansan]

Thanks, John. That's helping narrow things. That's probably my go-to route, if needed.

ExploreEnthusiast - so, it sounds like taking I-40 is an option from Ludlow to Needles. I've read various things about bike exits/entries, but with the sketchy state of NTH/66, it seems like it might be a more desirable route? And at 20 miles less, possibly more feasible in a day's ride (barring scorching heat, early start, etc.). I know that it all depends on seeing what the situation is once in the area, but I'm leaning toward the I-40 option, if it's available. I have no choice but to traverse the Mohave in the 3rd week of August . . . cause I ain't smart. (Can I get a camel with wheels on Amazon . . .)?

[jamawani]

When, exactly, are you planning on doing this?
June thru Sept average highs are 100F+.

I wish ACA would be more proactive with Interstate riding in western states.
Most western states permit Interstate riding except in urban areas.
California largely does not, but is inconsistent.
In the case of I-40, some entrances have signs banning bicycles, others do not.
Plus, county and state patrol officers probably assume that bikes are generally prohibited.

However -
According to ALL federal highway funding legislation since ISTEA of 1991,
Highway planning and construction must incorporate all users - including bicyclists.
In the case of I-40, where there is no functional alternative - i.e. Old US 66 bridges out -
then CalTrans must accommodate cyclists on I-40.
I-40 is safe - with wide shoulders and long sight lines.
California could install "Share the Road" signs to conform with federal highway legislation.

If you are stopped and cited, then you have standing to sue.
I have been reluctant to do this, but have asked politely for decades.
With state and national cycling organizational support file suit to withhold federal funding.
Sadly, it's always about money. Money talks.
In federal court, CalTrans would have a hard time justifying their actions.
Two key factors that the Federal Highway Administration considers are safety and cost.
Bicycle use of I-40 is in many respects safer for cyclists and the cost is negligible.
It shouldn't have to be this difficult.

https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/environment/bicycle_pedestrian/publications/multimodal_delivery/?_gl=1*wl55kv*_ga*MjEwMjE0OTY2NC4xNzIxOTY1Mjkx*_ga_VW1SFWJKBB*MTcyMTk2NTI5MC4xLjEuMTcyMTk2NTk3NC4wLjAuMA..

[The Kansan]

MAN, ya’ll are just great sources of info. John, EE & J - thank you!  My plan is a “dark-start”, 4-ish am. I need to be done by mid-morning, late-morning at the latest or I’ll cook. Course, hoping temps let up a tad by the  third week of August. Checking how much climbing to do along the route, too. Weather, etc. of course plays a factor. The good thing? You all have given me solid answers and options! Thank you! (And my Surly will look like a water buffalo!)

[jamawani]

Dear Kansan -

Don't know if your first name is Lawrence or Manhattan or Liberal ...
But mid to late August is still dangerously hot.

There is only one guaranteed place in between Ludlow and Needles - Desert Oasis.
It is a gas station / c-store with very high prices, but understandably so.
The owner probably pays a premium for anything delivered there.

Amboy sometimes has someone there, not often, usually on weekends.
Same for the historic site at Goffs - can't count on anyone being there.
Print off a H2O? sign in huge font on card stock -
Use a long roach-clip cord and hang it on your back for passing cars to see.
It is a good emergency method in the Mojave when cycling.

I did my doctoral work in Lawrence.
The Mojave ain't nothing like Kansas. For sure.
You are likely to have westerly tailwinds, but could have a brutal Santa Ana.
Almost no change of rain, except for the rare desert gully-washer.
Average temps are 100+ for highs; 70ish for lows.  But could be 110+.

On my list of touring routes in August - rated 1 to 10 -
The Mojave is about a minus 3.  Just sayin'.
And I have lots of touring experience.

Attached:
Wind rose for Daggett
75-year temp record for Daggett.
Needles is significantly hotter.

[jamawani]

PS -

The most direct route - all on I-40 - is 92+ miles.
You may get stopped.
Almost 100 miles if you take I-40 then go via Goffs.
Almost if you go via Amboy and Goffs.

Historic Route 66 is the way to go - - but not in August.

[The Kansan]

Jamawani - yep. Looks like the temps ain't gonna let up. I'm swallowing my pride on the better part of valor - finally. I think the old Victor Valley Transit Route 200 shuttle no longer exists (still trying to get ahold of them). I've done AMTRAK once before and it was an okay experience, and I can catch the Super Chief out of Barstow to Needles. I think that might be the way to go to be safe. Just too hot. Besides, I have to ship the bike out 10 days earlier, so I'll be on my road bike (w/o weight) for a few days and my legs could probably use the rest after the shock of some climbing prior to Barstow. So, rest day and a train ride might just be . . . the ticket . . . (Salina, by the way. Did my doctoral stuff in Ohio, though.) Don't need a bad scene in the desert when I'm trying to get to Annapolis Pier before the craziness of the election!

[John Nettles]

Are you already on your tour?  I just looked at WeatherSpark.com for the temps in Needles and Ludlow (Daggett County).  I gotta say if you do it, you might consider riding entirely at night.  Needles average low is 85* and the average high is 108*.  Those are averages so it can get 5* hotter.  Pay attention to what John (Jama) says regarding the heat.

I did a bit more research on the road closures.  All non-I40 roads are offiically closed between Exit 115 and Amboy.  There are at least four bridges out or under repair between Exit 115 and Amboy on NTH.  The first is between the jct of NTH and CA-66.  Here is the location:  https://maps.app.goo.gl/dKSHfPXF6cRw6meC6 .  The others are between the junction & Amboy and can be spotted using the satellite view and as you can see cars have been driving around them, some on purpose built bypasses.  So it appears the NTH is rideable and would be super quiet.  This is good but also bad in that if you need help, you probably aren't going to get it.

That said, if you are a fast rider, then go for Ludlow via I-40.  Just leave really early (time it so you arrive in Desert Oasis no later for the 6am opening) and be sure to confirm the night before that your motel reservation is still good in Ludlow before heading out.  However, with those temps, I would probably leave so I arrive no later than Noon in Ludlow so may pass DO before they open.   If a cop stops you for riding on I-40, just say you saw the "Road Closed" signs so had to detour onto I-40.  My guess is they won't bother you.  Oh, and have GOOD taillights and/or reflective vests as vehicles are not expecting a bike in the middle of the night.

That said, if you are like me in that I am probably no longer able to do 93+ miles into a headwind in 100*+ temps, you might consider riding to the Desert Oasis (timed for opening) to refresh then cut down toward Amboy.  This would make the day's ride "only" 75 miles in the heat of which about 38 are after DO.  Again, verify Amboy has lodging and food before doing this route.  I assume you are not camping. Then you have a either an easy 28 mile day into Ludlow or a 77 mile day into Barstow. 

Whatever you decide, please let us know the outcome. 

Tailwinds, John
EDIT:  You posted while I was typing so ignore

[The Kansan]

John - no worries! We were thinking along the same lines (I'd be heading East). I've been monitoring the temps, as well as the forecast for Ludlow, Amboy, Fenner and Needles. Everything is ranging 15-20 degrees higher with the heat wave. I-40, to me, is the only viable option (counting on 58 miles from Ludlow to the Desert Oasis, then to Needles the following day), but there's still the heat AND the ride prior from Barstow to Ludlow. After that, whether I ride it or train it, I've still got to deal with the heat through Kingman, but that would be in "shorter" trips, e.g. 40 miles to Oatman (overnight), 25 and Sitgreaves to Kingman, then on from there. I think that's doable and will have had a day of rest before starting to Oatman if I take AMTRAK. Always open for input!

[John Nettles]

OK, this may be a dumb/rude question but I am curious as to why are you trying to do this route in August instead of another route?  Being from Oklahoma, I usually head to cooler climes in August and we only average the low to mid 90s so I would not pick BR66 as a route to do in August. Not judging per se, just this route not for me in August. 

[jamawani]

Salina, Kansan -

Looks like all the bike spots for most days in August are already reserved.
What day do you plan to be in Barstow/Ludlow?

Glad to hear you're not planning to do Ludlow to Needles in one day.
Have you considered night riding?
The full moon will be on August 19 - so you have between the 17th and 21st with a near full moon.
And the waxing moon probably from the 14th.
It's 68 miles on Old Route 66 - ride from Ludlow, 10 pm to Desert Oasis 6 am
I'd use a flasher only selectively  so you don't spoil the night illumination.
You might encounter a dozen vehicles all night.
You will have to negotiated around (or over?) the closed bridges by moonlight.

Obviously, this is not something to do on I-40 -
as it will increase the odds of you getting stopped by about 200%.

You will be surprised how bright the desert is under a full moon.
Of course, if there are thick clouds, it's different, but clouds are quite rare.

Think about it.

Juan

[The Kansan]

First, to answer John's question: "Stupid is as Stupid does." Actually, mental exercise went into this, including weather, winds, and school scheduling. The ride is an awareness ride for music education and teacher mental health. The hope is to stop along the way (once I'm in civilization) to talk with students, teachers, radio, etc. Getting some nice exposure here already. School schedules would indicate that more folks are starting school as I head East, rather than the opposite. Weather gets cooler, too. At the end of the day, all things considered, the timing (except for the Mojave and some Southwest) was the best I could come up with. Travel schedule in the Spring is shot. Leaving Aug. 18th and wanting to be done by election in DC, then I have commitments the rest of November. Route 66 till Joplin. Jumping up to the Katy for a break (done it), then bits of the Eastern Express, Chicago to New York, then gliding down the GAP/C&O to finish off.

Jamawari: I'm definitely taking that into consideration . . . just still not sure about those 95 degree night-time forecasts . . . Good to know that full moon cycle, though! Great call!

[John Nettles]

I have noticed that when night riding, the same temperatures seems a lot cooler compared to the same temp at night, maybe 15 or 20 degrees worth.  Since I am assuming the humidity will be low, I would think that would help also.  Maybe go out for a ride now at night to see what I mean and see if that might work for you.   Since I finally got the direction correct (my mistake), I think riding is "doable", if ending ride before noon since the winds at least won't be a headwind (probably).  The combo of headwind and heat is what got me.  The big concern is if Amboy is full/closed. 

I wonder if you would have to worry about wildlife, i.e. coyotes, at night.  Not trying to sound alarmist, just never thought about it before.

Anyway, if the trains are indeed sold out (I really don't trust Amtrak's website), you can always rent a car one-way from Barstow to Needles (or Kingman) for about $210 one-way. 

Tailwinds, John