Bicycle lubrication question When, What and (more important What NOT! ) to oil

[Westinghouse]

I got wax build-up on the pulleys on the deraileur and elsewhere with white lightning or greased lightning or whatever they call it, but that sort of thing didn't bother me. I just scraped it off with a stick and kept going. That sort of thing was the least of my concerns. The thing that impressed me with it was it seemed to be a much better lubricant / friction-reducer than 3-in-one oil. At any rate, I crossed the continent on it exclusively and it was an asset all the way. I got it at Wal Mart.

[John Nelson]

Comparing White Lightning to 3-in-1 doesn't set the bar very high.

[johnsondasw]

  (We use an unorthodox chain-lube method that keeps chains clean and makes them last 20,000 miles or more.)

Care to elaborate?  I'd like my chains to last ten times as long as they do now!

[whittierider]

Care to elaborate?  I'd like my chains to last ten times as long as they do now!

http://forums.bicycling.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/671104717/m/1941016826?r=1051020536#1051020536
Near the bottom, there's a modified way to do it while on tour.

[sanuk]

(We use an unorthodox chain-lube method that keeps chains clean and makes them last 20,000 miles or more.)

Could the first writer please elaborate on this statement?  I'd sure like to know about something that makes a chain last 20,000 miles or more!  Out here in the wild East where it's either dust or mud - sometimes both - I seem to go through a chain on my daily use mountain bike once every two years.  Not sure of the mileage but I probably do on average 10 kms a day approx.  That's around 7-8,000 kms per two years.

Usually when the chain needs replacing so does the rest of the drive chain - front crank and rear cassette which gets expensive.  I'm due for another now.  I clean the chain quite regularly with one of those little cleaning machines where you add degreasing fluid or just dishwashing fluid plus water and spin the chain through the brushes.  I also clean the chain first with a toothbrush dipped in diesel which gets rid of the accumulated grease/dirt without drying the whole chain out like gasoline would.  Then after the shampoo I re-oil and wipe.  Looks and feels good until after the first few rides.

I'm now wondering about how long cranks and rear casettes should last and if the quality - or lack thereof - of the components they make in Taiwan that one gets out East - just about everywhere else too - is to blame.  Seems they should last longer than a couple of years regular riding.

[whittierider]

(We use an unorthodox chain-lube method that keeps chains clean and makes them last 20,000 miles or more.)

Could the first writer please elaborate on this statement?

Sanuk, the link giving the details is in the post right above yours.

To show a quote as a quote, you can put [quote] at the beginning and [/quote] at the end.  (I did another trick here to make them show instead of doing their job.)

[DaveB]

I seem to go through a chain on my daily use mountain bike once every two years.  Not sure of the mileage but I probably do on average 10 kms a day approx.  That's around 7-8,000 kms per two years.

Usually when the chain needs replacing so does the rest of the drive chain - front crank and rear cassette which gets expensive....... I'm now wondering about how long cranks and rear casettes should last and if the quality - or lack thereof

I usually get 6000 - 7000 miles (9700 - 11, 300 km) on a chain and cassette before the "stretch" is over 1/16" per foot of chain  which is about 1/2%  At that point, I replace the chain and cassette together.

You can change the chain much more frequently and have the cassette last longer but, since I use modestly priced cassettes (Shimano 105 or Campy Veloce) I see no benefit to spending much more on chains than the cassette cost.  If I used Dura Ace or Record cassettes the economics would favor frequent chain replacement.

I do think you are changing chainrings much too frequently as chainrings are far more tolerant of chain wear then cassettes.   I will typically get well over 25,000 miles on a set of chainrings with the chain replacement schedule I mentioned above.  Unless you are having shifting problems with your chainrings, they do not need to be changed.

[John Nelson]

I spend $30 on a chain and $70 on a cassette. I've never bought rings (my original ones are still good after 40,000 miles). I typically get 3000 miles on a chain and three chains to a cassette.

So 18,000 miles costs me six chains ($180) plus two cassettes ($140) for a total of $320.

If I pushed my chain to 6,000 miles, I would probably need a cassette for every chain.

In that case, 18,000 miles would cost me three chains ($90) and three cassettes ($210), for a total of $300. That's slightly cheaper, but I would guess that shifting smoothness would degrade near the end of those 6,000 miles, and I'd probably have gone through more chainrings, which would have greatly increased the cost.

Everybody makes their own tradeoffs.

Also, miles per chain isn't a constant. So you need to measure your chain. I measure my chain and replace it when it stretches 0.75%.

[sanuk]

On a 24 link stretched section of chain I'm 1/8 over 12 inches - 12 inches supposedly being the limit.  Beyond that it's worn.  However, the teeth on the most used cogs on the cassette are sharp and noticably thinner than the cogs I rarely use.  Same for the middle cog on the front crank which I'm on 99% of the time.  Worn teeth.  And this is approx two years after they were new and what, less than an average 10 kms a day.  The trouble here - a crappy little town in SE Asia - is sand -lots of it as the whole place is a construction zone and most of the little side roads are unpaved dirt which also gets dragged out onto the main roads.  I rode 900 miles on highways in the US this summer without even half the dirt I get after just a couple of trips to the local market here.

[whittierider]

I'm 1/8 over 12 inches - 12 inches supposedly being the limit.  Beyond that it's worn.

12" for 12 full links (or 24 half links) is what it should be brand new.  I replace at 1/16" over 12", or about 1/2%, and get at least 20,000 miles with my unorthodox chain lube method mentioned earlier.  Most people will let it get more worn, like out to 1/8" over 12", or 1%.

[paddleboy17]

It has been my experience that once a chain starts to stretch, it will stretch quickly.  There migh only be a hundred miles of riding. between 1/16" of stretch and 1/8" of stretch.   Chains are relatively cheap, so just replace it at the first sign of stretch.

[tonythomson]

I've got some QT85 use it on locks etc - it basically displaces water and coats everything with PTFE .  Often wondered about PTFE coating on the chain - anyone have experience?  (before I try it!)

[staehpj1]

Personally I think the key to long chain life lies in not using solvents, detergents, or other degreasers any more than absolutely necessary.  I try to minimize even washing with water to as minimal a frequency as I can and try to use very low pressure spray (just running water over it when muddy).

My theory is that what shortens the life of a chain the most is that excessive cleaning lets grit penetrate deeper into the chain.  The solvents or detergents also kill the lube that resides there and the lube does not penetrate there as readily as the solvents do.

Ideally I would never clean a chain even once in it's life, but sometimes I need to.  On tour this seems to be unlikely to be needed probably because I lube and wipe off the chain every few days.  Around home they seem to get more gunk on them and I wind up needing to clean them.  When that happens I usually just spray wd40 liberally and wipe it off.

Chains usually last me 10,000 miles or so.  Cassettes and rings I don't have a number for but they are both good for a very long time.

I replace when 12 links measure 12-1/16" or as soon as convenient after that.  I have not found that they go that quickly when they do start to "stretch" and I wouldn't worry much if I was a few hundred miles from the next bike shop, but do agree with Paddleboy that you might as well just replace them as soon as is convenient when they reach 12-1/16.

[DaveB]

If I pushed my chain to 6,000 miles, I would probably need a cassette for every chain.

That's slightly cheaper, but I would guess that shifting smoothness would degrade near the end of those 6,000 miles, and I'd probably have gone through more chainrings, which would have greatly increased the cost.

I'm more than surprised you don't need a new cassette with 3000 mile chain changes, particularly if the "stretch" is 0.75% at that point.  Typically the smaller, most used cogs will skip even at 0.5% elongation of the old chain when a new chain is used.

And, no, shifting doesn't degrade at 6000 or even more miles.  The chain and cassette are a matched set at that point.  I'm just concerned that the chain will break from fatigue if left in use too long.

Also, chainrings don't wear out at that point either and, as I mentioned, i get well over 25,000 miles per set. 

[sanuk]

(Chains are relatively cheap, so just replace it at the first sign of stretch.)

I don't mind replacing the chain, but it looks like the whole damned drive chain goes at the same time, and that will be expensive!  It's making nasty grinding noises which I'm none too sure aren't even coming from the bottom bracket.  I'm probably going to want to sell this bike soon as we look like making a significant move.  I have my tourer which I'd take along for sure.  So what to do?  Invest the money and try getting it back on the selling price, or try selling it as is?  Not sure I'd want to buy a bike that needs a whole new drive chain replacement.  It's a Trek 4300 up graded to 4400 specs.