Author Topic: hub generators  (Read 13128 times)

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Offline driftlessregion

Re: hub generators
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2011, 10:25:09 pm »
Jan Heine is one of the most respected cyclists and authors on cycling in the country, including to Adventure Cycling Magazine. To suggest that "bicycle Quarterly was making this stuff up" is absurd at best and libelous at worst. Your experience may have been different than Jan's but that is not proof of his dishonesty.

Offline RussSeaton

Re: hub generators
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2011, 12:57:57 pm »
Jan Heine is one of the most respected cyclists and authors on cycling in the country, including to Adventure Cycling Magazine. To suggest that "bicycle Quarterly was making this stuff up" is absurd at best and libelous at worst. Your experience may have been different than Jan's but that is not proof of his dishonesty.

Its a lot more libelous for Mr. Heine to write his stuff.  Shimano may have a claim against him.  He operates a bike shop.  He sells Schmidt hubs and lights.  Seems he has a vested interest to put down the competition.  He is most definitely not an independent reviewer.

Offline Pat Lamb

Re: hub generators
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2011, 01:52:02 pm »
Exemplifying the adage, "Fools rush in..."

Jan Heine is one of the most respected cyclists and authors on cycling in the country, including to Adventure Cycling Magazine. To suggest that "bicycle Quarterly was making this stuff up" is absurd at best and libelous at worst. Your experience may have been different than Jan's but that is not proof of his dishonesty.

He's also not an engineer.  (As an example, some of his writings on "planing" are just plain irritating.  I think Richard Schwinn explained that pretty well on a Terry podcast last year, but Jan insists that can't be right!)  Given Jan's experience and speed, I think he must have been on a 1200 km ride to cover two nights.  How could such an experienced randonneur allow this alleged numbness to occur?  Either he must have gripped the bars tightly or for too long without changing hand position, or he must have had poor equipment, like thin bar tape or poorly padded gloves.  I'd have thought the fastest American PBP finisher would know better than to execute either of these mistakes.

Its a lot more libelous for Mr. Heine to write his stuff.  Shimano may have a claim against him.  He operates a bike shop.  He sells Schmidt hubs and lights.  Seems he has a vested interest to put down the competition.  He is most definitely not an independent reviewer.

As I noted upthread, I did notice a buzz in my Shimano hub; also I noted it seems to be diminishing as I ride it more.  The DH-3N72, DH-3N80, and its cousins did come out after the 2007 PBP, didn't they?  I think it's possible your older Shimano hub didn't have that buzz, and Jan's relatively short test ride didn't allow it to improve.  

I don't think anybody could win a libel suit off this thread or Jan's review, except maybe some lawyers.

Squirrel!  How much night time riding do other tourists do?  Mine is confined to commuting and non-touring group rides in winter; the only thing I used a light on tour for was to hold the Otlieb map down.

Offline driftlessregion

Re: hub generators
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2011, 07:15:51 pm »
You are correct that it would constitute a conflict of interest to sell components that the seller is reviewing. When Bicycle Quarterly reviews a product that they sell they disclose that in the article. In this case, I found no evidence that Jan Heine sells any generator hubs on his website, and he does not operate a bike shop. He did disclose that one of the reviewers works for the manufacturer of SON hubs. You will also see that he invited Shimano to respond to his test results. This is what Jan says about conflict of interest: Q:“Doesn't that constitute a conflict of interest when you test these and other components for Bicycle Quarterly?
A: That is a real concern, and we are very aware of it. Our rule is simple: If a product is extraordinary, we sell it. So we usually first test components, and then decide whether to sell them. If we find new extraordinary products, we sell them as well. That way, we have no incentive to criticize components that compete with the ones we offer - we just offer them all. In many cases, the components we sell would not be available in North America otherwise, because the profit margins are too small. We feel that our readers are better served by having these components available, than if we told you about these fabulous parts that you cannot get. We disclose all potential conflicts of interest with each article. Our readers then can make up their own minds. Our main business is publishing Bicycle Quarterly. The components are only a sideline, so we don't feel the need to promote them excessively.With everything we test, we try hard to be objective. If anything, we are more critical of the products we sell. In our test of the Grand Bois "Ourson" tires, we said they weren't worth the extra money over Panaracers, because unlike other Grand Bois tires, they use an older tire mold with a less-than-optimal tread pattern. Conflicts of interest are unavoidable, because the cycling world is small. Most makers of "real-world" bicycles know each other, and many are good friends of ours. This close collaboration improves the quality of the bicycles they offer, so it is a good thing. But it means that conflicts of interest are unavoidable. It's actually a lot easier to criticize a component we sell than one sold by a friend!”
My original point was that just because you have a different experience does not mean that it did not happen to someone else and is not sufficient cause to question someone’s honesty. Questioning  methodology however is fair game.

Offline Tourista829

Re: hub generators
« Reply #19 on: February 05, 2011, 03:51:35 pm »
I really don't see the big deal here. I appreciate all the info and interest, in the States. Most people don't ever ride enough, at night, to justify this set up. I commute a couple of days a week and ride through a park, in the dark. I started with a Breezer Uptown with a Shimano N30 Hub powering a BM Lumotec Oval Plus, in the front & BM Stanlicht rear light. 26x1.60. I have ridden the bike with and without the hub. I have timed a 25 mile ride and it was noticeably slower. Now I know, according to Peter White it produces the most drag. I did not notice any vibration. I did notice some numbness but I attributed it to getting a mild shock due to poor grounding. LOL  :) In Europe, where many bicyclist use dyno hubs, for commuting, the Schmidt SON 20/28 are the odds on favorite for perfomance, durablility and the least drag. I look at it as an investment, which you can move from one bike to the next. I have seen Robenne's set up and it is top notch. Although Shimano has made major improvements, I would go with the Schmidt SON 28, Edelux front light, and the Ewerke to power my accessories. To each their own.

Offline hamilgs

Re: hub generators
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2011, 11:09:24 pm »
I have & very much like my SON 20 (bought complete wheel from Peter White), on a 406 rim, on the front of my Tour Easy recumbent.  On the first ride after fitting, I noticed a definite vibration in the handlebars at about 19 mph, settling out above 21 mph.  I think the vibration is due to the SON hub generator.--george
Zippered Tour Easy EX
To recline is devine